After creating a feature class, it would be convenient to go back after data input, and make changes to the field ordering (position).
@SSWoodward thank you for the clarification 🙂
@SSWoodward thank you for the quick response, if my idea is similar to the below comment on the idea you shared then yes of course please merge it.
However, I am kinda surprised that this idea has been around for so long and yet no tool is still available for it.
Thanks for the idea @Ed_
This idea seems to be a duplicate of an existing idea, linked below. If you agree, let us know and I will merge this with it.
Permanently Reorder Fields In a Table
Hi all, hope all is well, currently if you have to reorder columns in ArcGIS Pro, the user has to rely on `The Export Table` or `Featureclass to Featureclass` tool which in this case will just create duplicate data with rearranged columns. So, I suggest to have a dedicated small tool for this in Pro as one no duplicate datasets will have to be created and second it will really help when creating a model.
@LaurenAlt I feel your frustration with this. What ESRI could do, is to offer to store personal table formatting in an external file like they do with Favorites or Styles. That way, every time you access a specific table, it would already be formatted like you want it. Or Esri could adopt the ability to create table views that exist outside of a Project; like let me create a view in a FGDB that references another table or table join where I could set it up to look like I want. That would be wonderful, too. Then I could save that FGDB in my Favorites and just connect to that view whenever I wanted to view/edit the data. These are possible work-a-rounds ESRI could try to look into for the users.
Presently, outside of a 3rd Party add-on, the only way to permanently change the field order is to change the table schema using either Feature Class to Feature Class or Table to Table GP Tools and changing the field order during the creation. Outside of a FGDB that you own or manage, this is not always practical or even recommended and depending on your environment and/or user rights, may not even be possible. Exploring a 3rd Party solution may be your best option, for now.
Hello, LaurenAlt. You can try to do this with XTools Pro Modify Table. If you have multiple datasets with the same field schema you can quickly reorder them using Save field schema and Load field schema options.
Please include a way to permanently reorder fields in a feature class. Reordering them in the project, then having to re-do it every time is time consuming and very frustrating.
ArcGIS Pro 2.6: “feature class to feature class” tool fails to reorder the fields,
Any update on this for Pro 2.7?
And a SUPER SIMPLE way to do it in ArcPy please!!!
FieldMappings are a pain.
Worthy (and correct) suggestions, but what happens when the feature class is in a feature dataset, is participating in a topology, subject to Pro attribute rules, or other Esri-land features specific to that (and only that) particular feature class? I think this strikes at the heart of the issue. Even if re-creating or renaming the feature class back to the original name can be done, trying to remember and recreate linkages to other GDB objects is the issue people are leery of I believe.*
Hence "ArcGIS should allow the ability to permanently reorder fields in a table." ArcGIS taking care of all of those thing with the Esri ecosystem. Not you.
* Assumptions untested.
Thanks Angela.
We could find out several workarounds but wanted to know if reordering fields is eventually technically impossible.
If making a copy of the feature class isn't an issue for you, an easy solution that I've just been shown by ESRI (thanks Chris) is to use the feature class to feature class conversion tool. This allows the reordering of fields that is then permanently saved in a new feature class.
Ray, you did provide work-arounds and I should have at least acknowledged that. I see what you are getting at with attempting to explain the complexity as well.
Nevertheless, if ESRI's desktop apps can handle all the steps involved in an intersect process in a single tool, they can handle all the steps required to provide an abstracted, apparently 'in-place' field re-ordering and all the steps needed to make it happen properly, especially give the demand, marketing claims, and cost of software. This is the whole point of a button-pusher desktop front-end. It's largely irrelevant that behind the scenes a new table might have to be created and the data moved there and any dependencies handled cleanly. EDIT: ie, that it's hard is irrelevant. Is this enterprise software or not? The cost is definitely there.
That is well said Matt. We can understand why this has not happened, but an ESRI acknowledgment of the techy reasons behind the apparent impasse might go some way to smoothing things in the customer relationship around this issue! Ray does offer some insights here, but after so long perhaps they are not sufficient...
Cue broken record: we've been asking to be able to permanently reorder fields in place for 20 years, since ArcMap v8. We see "only" ~33,000 votes now because that's this is just the latest incarnation of the feature request.
It hasn't been done because it's hard. Changing a column's ordinal position is not in the SQL standard and not supported by most database vendors. There are two notable exceptions I'm aware of: MS Access and MySQL. There are various workarounds and most require recreating the table and deleting the original (a couple methods using this approach are described in this thread). My personal favourite so far is re-ordering in MS Access via personal gdb.
However, it is to Esri's shame that they've never come out and said "Hey look, we hear you, we understand what you want. This, this, and this are why we haven't developed a solution". For that I am truly angry with them. It was only after a lot of time working in different problem domains and doing my own research that I understand why. Please Esri, live the courage of your convictions, and declare them (and why) when you have them.
Joseph Rigley, Blair Hornung
I upvoted this a decade ago. It would be a nice-to-have. Not denying that.
It sounds easy. A dbf or access database is one thing. Countless RDBMS's that do not allow changes in place is another. Granted, Esri could make it available where it is easy to get accomplished. But I do not expect it to be accomplished any time soon on RDBMS's.
I gave 2 avenues to get the end result. I shared because some don't know fields can indeed be reordered (albeit not in place).
What's with the nose gazing Ray?
I am not being lazy when I am sorting through dozens of feature classes (that other people ordered chaotically) with hundreds of fields in Catalog, or burying deep into an SDE in SQL developer doing off-the-cuff explorations and development upon messy data structures. Creating neat and tidy custom queries every time, or running a feature class to feature class is not desirable to many people. If ESRI can do most mundane tasks 3 different ways from Sunday, why not build a tool like this to let the users work the way they want it done?
All weez want is a little efficiency
Users (>30,000 upvotes, presumably most of these paying license/support maintenance) have been requesting the ability to re-order fields in place for a decade now. There is no excuse nor HTFU commentary that does more than whitewash this embarrassment.
First, reordering fields is possible using FeatureClassToFeatureClass. Granted, this is not in place reordering. But reordering is possible. [create reordered copy via FC2FC, delete the original, rename or copy the reordered dataset, apply permissions and indexes as appropriate). To boot, it's not very difficult.
Second, X-Ray can reorder fields.
Last, in old school apps run on databases, it was up to the app to create the field order. This was because more than one field order could be required for any given table (feature class). I don't see where this has changed. ArcMap, ArcPro, and ArcServer all allow reordering of fields. Yes, just in the mxd (not in the originating database). But it's on the app developer to create the field order desired/required. For that matter, they can (proactively) also turn off the visibility of fields not needed (in the app). That doesn't seem to be happening anymore. That isn't a database problem.
Lazily grabbing all fields and throwing them in an app with the default order is like doing a SELECT * instead of selecting each field. Simply a bad technique. Same goes for dropping a feature class into any app. Expect the order to not be the way you want and move them in the app.
Jamal,
It is implemented. Turn editing off, right click on the layer and select Design-->Fields. From there you should have full control over the field order, name, alias, etc. In the example below I moved "ROADSEG_ID" down simply by dragging it.
This appear not to be available in Pro 2.5, either. Hope to have it implemented in the upcoming releases
Ha! They're 2 updates behind!
lol yeah never!
Would we be able to get a decennial update from ESRI on this idea? 🙂
This idea speaks to why we still are using pGDB, or developing in pGDB a schema. I tell all of our park GISers's who need to develop a schema.... do it in a pGDB, and the last step, save to fGDB. I know Xtools, but pGDB is more reliable and across the board safer... Soon, even access is going to be a limitation. Trimble users with Pathfinder Office and the data dictionary tool can do this with a simple "float tool", a up or down arrow that moves a field up or down. And it sticks! I think this is a great idea.
The reason Esri has not supported this is because users expect all tables to support such a tool - not just shapefile and gdb. Esri supports many database formats and client server setups.
XTools Pro has a nice Table Restructure tool that works on file-based data.
I was able to accomplish reordering fields on a shapefile using a QGIS geoprocession tools called "Refactor Fields".
More information here:
spatial etl - Permanently reorder fields in data (shp, gdb) - Geographic Information Systems Stack Exchange
But it should be implemented in ArcGIS Pro then, if they want to have more users taking the leap.
I voted this up like 10 years ago given that ArcGIS Desktop is getting little love these days i.e. slated to be retired by ESRI at some point in the near future I doubt we'll ever see this feature.
That's otherwise classified as "Not in product plan".
19 to 20, since ArcMap v8.
Realllly doesn't Jack Dangermond ever need to reorder fields?? Does he even use his own products
Ha! Unfortunately Noel is incorrect. It hasn't been 9 years, IT'S BEEN AT LEAST 15 YEARS! (See my post above).
I think you need some faith that they will eventually do it! /s
After 9 years I think we can move this out of the 'under consideration' column and into the 'not gonna do it' column.
I remember discussions about this circa 2000 and ArcMap v8.
Esri Inc. just doesn't care (which is distinct from their staff, see notables like Kory Kramer).
This is not a convenience or nice-to-have, it is often a necessity that needs workarounds that take extra time and effort to achieve. Looking forward to seeing this in ArcGIS Pro in the future.
You could use QGIS with the Refactor Fields tool:
https://docs.qgis.org/testing/en/docs/user_manual/processing_algs/qgis/vectortable.html#refactor-fields
It says "the original layer is not modified" - this is the default
behaviour, but you can actually overwrite your existing shapefile if you're
confident.
All I want to do is create a new field and put it next to another similar field further up in the fields view. This seems like a basic feature that should have been incorporated into the product from the beginning. Being able to re-arrange field order is a key feature in organizing any data table...no need to "consider" this feature - get it done
Brian, your perspective largely matches mine. For me, these types of limitations have been great at getting me into either alternative solutions like PostGIS/QGIS, to the overall greater detriment of my opinion and usage of the ESRI stack, or forced me to do more re-useable scripting of UI-laborious processes.
Disability to re-order fields isn't the end of the world, but the lack of any solution from ESRI in the face of this level of demand for a feature, even in a limited implementation, is the problem. If this type of change request went into the QGIS stream, we would probably see something in the following months, not a decade (or ever in this case). Given the cost differential between platforms, that's utterly embarrassing.
With the change from ArcView 3 to 8, there were significant benefits to migrating once the bugs were ironed out of 8 (a long process as I recall, not until 8.2 or 8.3 was it fairly universally adopted in my world), as well as a new data format (GDB) with lots of new capabilities and less limitations than shapefiles/coverages. With Pro, there's just not much good reasons for users that haven't been forced into ArcGIS Online to even open it unless they are naturally early-adopters. Until there is a forcing through licensing (a thing ESRI tried), compatibility, or a wider need to use ESRI's online services in a significant way Desktop cannot, I don't see Pro really coming on like the ESRI hype seems to want.
It's an aside from the ArcGIS Idea being discussed here, but my observation as a longtime user of ARC/INFO (since before ARCEDIT and AML existed), an ArcGIS 8.0 Technology Preview participant, and a national technical support manager of an Esri International Distributor during the MapObjects/SDE/ArcView/ArcInfo Workstation to ArcGIS cutover was that most large ARC/INFO sites did not cutover to ArcGIS until most feature equivalency was achieved and that took until ArcGIS 9.2 about 6 years later.
The effort in replacing the architecture of ArcGIS Desktop 10.x by that of ArcGIS Pro is no less trivial, and I think is going well. Both architectural replacements have involved massive platforms, and I think the effort involved on many fronts should not be underestimated.
I have preferred working in ArcGIS Pro rather than ArcMap for the last 2-3 years despite wishing that both had Arc: PULLITEMS available.
Agreed, it's something that never happened. Might have been nice, but it's not the end of the world to need to create a replacement table.
Right now, almost four years after I first saw a beta "ArcGIS 11," I'm still switching from ArcGIS Pro back to the 32-bit app sometimes; this week when having stability problems while editing (merge, explode) and building geodatabase topology in ArcGIS Pro, I worked in ArcMap for a few hours, then was able to work with my changes in ArcGIS Pro, which I'd otherwise prefer to use. After watching this feature request thread for a couple of years, I'm in a better place---because now I'll pick and choose among ArcMap, ArcGIS Pro, or PostGIS/QGIS depending on what tool works best. Sure I'm still copying stuff to new tables to reorder fields, but if I do that while writing spatial SQL in PostGIS, I can complete a geoprocessing step or two during each table copy for my trouble.
It's good to have choices, although I'm a little bit surprised to see how very slowly ArcMap is fading into ArcGIS Pro.
Back in the day, ArcINFO 7 went out in a flash for me, but ArcView GIS 3 stayed around sort of like this.
Maybe it's just the (Esri) way of things?
-=Brian Q
Surely Cattyann, no one demands that it be in Desktop...how about ArcGIS Pro.
We've been discussing/arguing about not having this feature at least since Esri adopted python in 2005. It's been almost 15 years! If it hasn't happened by now, pretty sure it's not going to happen!! I think it's funny(?) that this thread is tagged "Under Consideration". This thread is 9 years old!
I don’t see ESRI making this happen since they have pretty much stopped development on ArcGIS Desktop
And pushing ArcCatalog on everyone.
I think it would be incredibly helpful to be able to permanently reorder fields in a table. Right now, I use the X-Ray add-in for ArcCatalog to reorder fields. It has problems, such as dropping subtypes, but is currently the easiest method I have come across. The add-in includes a reororder fields tool. See links below:
Item page: https://www.arcgis.com/home/item.html?id=9ea218ff575f4a5195e01a2cae03a0ae
Intro Video: Introduction to X-Ray for ArcCatalog Video | Esri
xraytools #xray
If the data is in a Personal geodatabase (pGdB)(aka MS_Access), open the
attribute table in Access, go to "Designer View" and rename fields,
change attributes, reorder fields and SAVE ... all will be OK in ESRI IF
you do NOT add/delete records.
This is true for SQL_Express database (xGdB) using SQL Management
Studio ... probably also true for data in MS_SQL enterprise geodatabases
(eGdB) ... My paranoia has not let me do that ... I copy from the eGdB
to xGdB, make my changes and then copy the data back...
If the schema changes are SO EASY with MS_Access &
MS_SQL_Management_Studio, why can't ESRI do it (connect to Microsoft
code) to do this in Microsoft format databases?
Mike Hickey
Tulare County IT/GIS
mhickey@co.tulare.ca.us
>>> Brian Quinn <geonet@esri.com> 11/9/2018 11:34 AM >>>
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ArcGIS should allow the ability to permanently reorder fields in a
table new comment by Brian Quinn
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I stopped trying to do this. Now, I write a single spatial SQL query
to PostGIS and visualise in QGIS. I get the attributes that I want in
one step. I can export to share back to ArcGIS Pro users
Brian B. Quinn
brian.quinn@sfgov.org
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Following ArcGIS should allow the ability to permanently reorder fields
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I stopped trying to do this. Now, I write a single spatial SQL query to PostGIS and visualise in QGIS. I get the attributes that I want in one step. I can export to share back to ArcGIS Pro users
Hmm. I note that there is a "Refactor Fields" tool in an available GIS toolset that might be employed in a Rube Goldberg-inspired workflow to change field orders in geospatial data tables. Might be worth a look.
2018 and counting.
Hi Cattyann
I totally agree. It’s often important, particularly in large datasets, to list fields in a logical order to make reading and interpretation easier.
Not providing such basic tools just forces users to find alternatives & may result in them loosing customers!
Happy mapping,
Cheers, Angela
Angela Pollett
Senior GIS Analyst (Part-time Monday to Thursday)
Spatial Information
Department of Natural Resources & Mines
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Glad I'm not the only one I've used EtGeoWizard has helped me more times than I can count still using it while I'm waiting for funds to get latest version of XTools since the free trial expired.
XTools allow you to do this without having to create another file can't understand why ESRI can't make this happen
after all these years you would think they would add this to ArcGISPro.
Cattyann Campbell
GIS Administrator
Tompkins County ITS: GIS Division
128 E. Buffalo St.
Ithaca, NY 14850-4207
Direct: (607)274-5418 | Main: (607)274-5417
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Yes I totally agree! My work around is to use ETGeoWizard
This has been under consideration for 7 years and still nothing. I started using a third party application called Xtools to do this type of work.
Make it simples for us ESRI!
yes yes yes yes. yes again. the workaround in arcpy is a pain in the behind.
There are some workarounds documented at the GIS Stack Exchange in the Q&A entitled
but implementing an equivalent to ArcInfo Workstation's PULLITEMS would be far preferred.
Re-ordering fields was available years ago in Arc/INFO workstation and was very useful. Years later the reasons for needing to reorder fields have not changed. So why remove the functionality or force users to use 3rd party software to do the task. Stop the prevarication and put back the function of reordering fields.
I do it all the time in MS Access. However, it only works with personal geodatabases.
All I want to do is be able to create a new field, and then arrange that column where I please, not be forced to have it lag in the back of the table (far right). Yes I can re-arrange it but this is only temporary, after I close the application the fields go back to their initial arrangement.
Wow - its the end of 2016 and still this hasnt been implemented...
Well at least designing tables can be done in Pro with a new niftier table view more like Access.
This may have been mentioned already in the many, many comments on this item, but one solution is to Export your Geodatabase to an XMLWorkspace Document (Schema-Only). You can then open the document in an XML Editor and rearrange the fields as you desire. Personally, I favor XML Notepad since it makes working with specific sections of the XML easier since you can drag and drop entire fields to order them.
Once you have your fields rearranged in your XML Workspace document, you can then import the XMLWorkspace Document to create a new Geodatabase. This will create an empty Geodatabase containing all of the domains, subtypes, feature datasets, etc. that you've defined in your Geodatabase as well as empty shells of the feature classes within it. The new field order you specified in the XMLWorkspace Document for a given feature class will now be in place in this empty feature class shell
From there, you just use the Simple Data Loader to load each feature class in your new Geodatabase back up with data in the corresponding feature class in your legacy database. Provided you haven't made any radical schema changes and just reordered fields, everything should line up 1:1 since the field names and datatypes would all be the same. If you do make changes beyond reordering the fields, you'll likely need to match the source field from the legacy feature class to the target field in your new feature class
I know this works for File Geodatabases and personal Geodatabases. I've never tested it on an SDE Database so I'd recommend some extensive testing before doing it there. Realistically, this is only practical for small changes that you need to make because if your Geodatabase contains hundreds of feature classes, then using the Simple Data Loader to go through each and load it up will become pretty tedious. It is one possible workaround though.
Unfortunately, with over 28,000 points on an idea that is 6 years old, I wouldn't count on this capability ever being delivered. I would try to give Esri the benefit of the doubt on this. Reordering fields at a Database level is not a capability that most databases offer (that I am aware of), so their options of implementing this might be a bit restricted.
Update: I created an idea which I feel is a nice compromise if Esri is actually limited in their ability to allow reordering fields permanently. It involves updating the layerfile specification to capture the field order to that the displayed order of fields can be persisted between ArcMap sessions. Allow the field order of a Feature Class and Table to be specified within a Layerfile. https://community.esri.com/ideas/12679
As a practical option that just works now, use ArcGIS Pro 1.3.1 to reorder and rename fields in a File Geodatabase as you see fit to get the columns tidy. Maybe even define a suitable index then run Sort tool to get the rows sequenced nicely. Copy that File GDB to server or export the fixed up Feature Class to SDE as appropriate, and fire up ArcCatalog to define the service and publish it on ArcGIS for Server. It's not too loopy of a workflow if your data is fairly static.
JMTCW,
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