topic Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1 in ArcGIS Pro Questions

ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

SeanAdlai — Mon, 31 May 2021 14:30:15 GMT

Apple M1 Running ArcGIS Pro and Desktop as follows

1. Apple iMac M1
- https://www.apple.com/imac-24/

2. Parallels (Install parallels on M1 Computer)
- https://kb.parallels.com/en/125038

3. Windows Insider preview ARM 64 (Install Windows
- https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windowsinsiderpreviewARM64

4. Install ArcGIS Pro and/or Desktop on Windows VM

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

MarcelSt-Germain — Mon, 31 May 2021 14:50:01 GMT

Hi, Pro 2.8? Have you make some tests? Any issues?

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

SeanAdlai — Mon, 31 May 2021 15:07:47 GMT

Hi Marcel.

Yes
Pro - 2.8
Desktop - 10.8.1

No Issues so far.

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

MarcelSt-Germain — Mon, 31 May 2021 15:12:56 GMT

Do you work with a Pc to see how this emulation stand? If so what Pc configuration you have. On M1 is slower, faster?

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

V_StuartFoote — Mon, 31 May 2021 17:12:43 GMT

Two issues; one, Microsoft does not license its ARM 64 Windows you are violating your Insiders Preview use conditions; two, Windows ARM driver support for perifireals (digitizers, scanners, printers) is not there.

Parralels bit, but VMWare is taking a pass for its Fusion product [1] until Microsoft's Windows 10 ARM licensing is clarified. Meanwhile this is not legal. Supposedly Microsoft is working on its own ARM Risc implementation--why would they license their ARM based Windows for use on M1 chips? They might, but why should they aid their competition?

[1] https://blogs.vmware.com/teamfusion/2021/04/fusion-on-apple-silicon-progress-update.html

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

SeanAdlai — Mon, 31 May 2021 18:04:59 GMT

Hey VStuartFoote.
really good questions

1. I just signed up for the Insider beta and its a free download.
I'm not using for production, so i'm not aware of any licensing violations.
please let me know if I am. I want to know if ARM will work.

2. I am a VMWare Fan. Will check and see.
Thanks.

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

MarcelSt-Germain — Mon, 31 May 2021 18:41:16 GMT

It's true. I think, for now is just to see how work ArcGIS Pro on M1. Until Microsoft release windows for ARM which I'm doubtful. Microsoft will port the key product to Mac M1 but, for the windows itself it's an other game, unless PC makers start moving to ARM and Microsoft see business there.

Esri users will have to stick with PC (like me using my Mac with Remote Desktop to control that dedicated PC) or move away from ESRI product since for them, Mac are not in their business plan. At least what they tell us.

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

SeanAdlai — Mon, 31 May 2021 19:38:14 GMT

Hello Marcel.
Here are the tests I performed

Hope this helps

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

SeanAdlai — Mon, 31 May 2021 19:42:03 GMT

This might be clearer.

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

PeterKnoop — Mon, 31 May 2021 20:01:04 GMT

@SeanAdlai if you have the time, it would be great if you could run the standardized tests from the ArcGIS Pro Performance Analysis Tool (PAT) on your M1 setup. (If you have not used PAT yet, please see the recent blog post for information on how to obtain and install it: Announcing the ArcGIS Pro Performance Assessment Tool (PAT).)

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

fstring — Mon, 31 May 2021 21:45:54 GMT

Here's the Insider Preview Agreement. Which provision exactly is being violated here by testing ESRI software? I see none at all and would argue this kind of exercise is exactly why the preview exists. The Agreement simply limits Microsoft's exposure to liability.

https://insider.windows.com/en-us/program-agreement

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

V_StuartFoote — Mon, 31 May 2021 22:46:39 GMT

Nope! Just because you can does not make it legal or ethical. Microsoft does not intend for Insider Previews to be run on ARM hardware/os combinations other than what they support (think Surface Pro X). The ARM 64 Windows os is available for OEM working on Microsoft approved architecture. That aint Apple M1 ARM.

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-insider/developers/get-started

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-insider/troubleshooting

Do this at your own peril--or your employer who's purchased an ArcGIS Pro seat for you.

Sorry that you are stuck with an unsupported M1 Apple, but that is the current state--legally.

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

fstring — Mon, 31 May 2021 23:10:32 GMT

You still haven't posted any evidence this is "illegal". I registered for the program with a personal gmail address, the Insider Preview Agreement is the legally binding document under which the terms are governed. It's not just meant for OEMs. Register, accept the agreement that limits their liability, welcome to program! It's right in the first link you sent. And ArcGIS Pro is running like a champ in this environment.

Don't call MS or ESRI for support, obviously. And if MS hasn't released a version you can purchase within 180 days of installation, tough. But under no possible interpretation is this "illegal" and it's absurd to suggest it.

If you find a legal document that contradicts this, I'd love to see it. No blog posts, how-tos or other content inadmissible in court or arbitration, though.

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

SeanAdlai — Tue, 01 Jun 2021 13:29:52 GMT

Thanks Peter.

Tool ran fine.
The instructions about how to compare them are not clear to me.
- Maybe that portion can be more simply stated.

In any case, here are results.

STARTUP

------------------

ArcGIS Pro Metrics

------------------

--- Fixed Metrics ---

CIMReadCounter = 19

CIMUpdateCounter = 0

CurrentDLLCount = 384

CurrentLocalDLLCount = 190

CurrentMemoryUsage = 1458704384

CurrentThreadCount = 83

HTTPRequestCancelCount = 0

HTTPRequestCount = 25

LicenseTime = 00:00:09.1959835

StartupDLLCount = 253

StartupLocalDLLCount = 93

StartupMemoryUsage = 299933696

StartupThreadCount = 48

StartupTime = 00:00:19.6589809

TotalBlockedTime = 0

TotalHungTime = 23500

TotalPaneConstructTime = 9094

TotalRequestCancelCount = 0

TotalRequestCount = 276

TotalTaskTime = 0

UICIMReadCounter = 221

UICIMUpdateCounter = 9

--- Named Metrics ---

Startup:Initialize_and_process_DAML = 2572

Startup:ShowWindow = 850

Startup:Wait_for_licensing = 8420

Startup:Initialization_complete = 8403

ProjectLoad:InternalOpenProjectAsync = 7907

ProjectLoad:InternalOpenMap = 1641

ProjectLoad:CreatePane_Instance1 = 9094

==================

Execution Complete

PerfTools Script Execution Time = 00:00:00.5861415

==================

ANALYSIS
06/01/2021 07:45 STDOUT INFO Test: Analysis_GnatcatcherWorkflow

06/01/2021 07:45 STDOUT INFO 2.8.0.29751

06/01/2021 07:45 STDOUT INFO Setup successful

06/01/2021 07:45 STDOUT INFO =====Buffer successful=====

06/01/2021 07:45 STDOUT INFO Buffer: 2.122

06/01/2021 07:45 STDOUT INFO =====Select Layer by Attribute successful=====

06/01/2021 07:45 STDOUT INFO Select Layer by Attribute: 0.058

06/01/2021 07:45 STDOUT INFO =====Pairwise Erase successful=====

06/01/2021 07:45 STDOUT INFO Pairwise Erase: 1.147

06/01/2021 07:45 STDOUT INFO =====Intersect successful=====

06/01/2021 07:45 STDOUT INFO Intersect: 4.617

EDITING

Bookmark, Map, DrawTime, AverageFPS, MinimumFPS, FPSSamples, TimeStamp

-------- --- -------- ---------- ---------- ---------- ---------

3D Plan View, Rooftop Scene, 00:00:13.9951989, 68.3395531832318, 26.0217417129315, 128, 2021-06-01T11:59:30.2454719Z

----

Task: Draw Polyline Fence

----

EditFeatureLayer::

Name:"Fence"

Map:"Rooftop Plan"

RegistrationType:"Nonversioned"

ShapeType:"Polyline"

Dimension:"3D"

EditCreateR::

EditOperationTime:"00:00:00.5990337"

EditDrawTime:"00:00:01.3837081"

Creates("Rooftop Plan/Fence",14)

Creates("Rooftop Scene/Fence",14)

----

Task: Digitize Trees

----

EditFeatureLayer::

Name:"Trees_screen"

Map:"Rooftop Plan"

RegistrationType:"Nonversioned"

ShapeType:"Point"

Dimension:"3D"

EditCreateR::

EditOperationTime:"00:00:00.2405487"

EditDrawTime:"00:00:02.8194469"

Creates("Rooftop Plan/Trees_screen",25,26,27,28,29,30)

Creates("Rooftop Scene/Trees_screen",25,26,27,28,29,30)

EditUndo::

EditOperations.Count:"2"

EditOperationTime Average:"00:00:00.2838930"

EditOperationTime Total:"00:00:00.5677861"

EditDrawTime Average:"00:00:01.4050822"

EditDrawTime Total:"00:00:02.8101644"

Bookmark, Map, DrawTime, AverageFPS, MinimumFPS, FPSSamples, TimeStamp

-------- --- -------- ---------- ---------- ---------- ---------

3D Plan View, Rooftop Scene, 00:00:05.8524316, 165.779690470519, 27.6422966144703, 54, 2021-06-01T11:59:47.3506168Z

==================

Execution Complete

PerfTools Script Execution Time = 00:00:32.1669386

==================

SPATIAL ANALYSIS

06/01/2021 08:02 STDOUT INFO Test: SpatialAnalysis

06/01/2021 08:02 STDOUT INFO 2.8.0.29751

06/01/2021 08:03 STDOUT INFO =====Slope successful=====

06/01/2021 08:03 STDOUT INFO Slope: 38.374

06/01/2021 08:14 STDOUT INFO =====SlopeTest dataset created=====

06/01/2021 08:14 STDOUT INFO SlopeTest dataset: 669.385

06/01/2021 08:24 STDOUT INFO =====Aspect successful=====

06/01/2021 08:24 STDOUT INFO Aspect: 592.479

06/01/2021 08:24 STDOUT INFO =====AspectTest dataset created=====

06/01/2021 08:24 STDOUT INFO AspectTest dataset: 0.493

06/01/2021 08:25 STDOUT INFO =====Viewshed successful=====

06/01/2021 08:25 STDOUT INFO Viewshed: 56.064

06/01/2021 08:25 STDOUT INFO =====ViewshedTest dataset created=====

06/01/2021 08:25 STDOUT INFO ViewshedTest dataset: 0.5

06/01/2021 08:25 STDOUT INFO CUDA/GPU processing DISABLED

2D RENDERING

------------------------

Zoom To Bookmarks Script

------------------------

Bookmark, Map, DrawTime, AverageFPS, MinimumFPS, FPSSamples, TimeStamp

-------- --- -------- ---------- ---------- ---------- ---------

Home, Layers, 00:00:00.0010852, 151.080799388886, 31.6618938446045, 1, 2021-06-01T11:43:12.0524599Z

Home, Layers, 00:00:07.3462597, 153.379304116708, 27.3261219724532, 62, 2021-06-01T11:43:28.3018019Z

Springwater Drive, Layers, 00:00:06.5677465, 159.869227756365, 25.8038719008203, 61, 2021-06-01T11:43:39.9504417Z

Woodstock/52nd, Layers, 00:00:06.8780010, 150.616159735593, 26.6682266576681, 64, 2021-06-01T11:43:51.8989298Z

Reed College Campus, Layers, 00:00:06.6118607, 110.321221997756, 26.2433075470025, 61, 2021-06-01T11:44:03.5855518Z

Gladstone Street, Layers, 00:00:06.1533160, 167.665385967001, 24.5933879151156, 57, 2021-06-01T11:44:14.8158541Z

Powel/26th, Layers, 00:00:06.8479030, 106.113119996211, 26.1235184443649, 64, 2021-06-01T11:44:26.7394748Z

I405/I5, Layers, 00:00:06.5500846, 111.148903051369, 25.4940740168095, 61, 2021-06-01T11:44:38.3630885Z

Burnside/I405, Layers, 00:00:07.6566880, 139.040721124327, 27.7432928085327, 71, 2021-06-01T11:44:51.0984019Z

PGE Park, Layers, 00:00:06.9660749, 118.98439404318, 25.7470573778264, 64, 2021-06-01T11:45:03.1374028Z

Jefferson Street, Layers, 00:00:06.4353537, 137.013936145848, 26.2562834906081, 60, 2021-06-01T11:45:14.6376592Z

--------------

DrawTime Sum: 00:01:08.0143733, Count: 11, Average: 00:00:06.1831248

AverageFPS Sum: 83348.4098860699, Count: 616, Average: 135.305860204659

MinimumFPS Sum: 16161.8213326633, Count: 616, Average: 26.2367229426352

FPSSampleRate = 100 ms

==================

Execution Complete

PerfTools Script Execution Time = 00:02:08.4407608

==================

3D RENDERING
------------------------

Zoom To Bookmarks Script

------------------------

Bookmark, Map, DrawTime, AverageFPS, MinimumFPS, FPSSamples, TimeStamp

-------- --- -------- ---------- ---------- ---------- ---------

Home, Globe layers, 00:00:05.6858308, 28.9506554950315, 4.62908043196568, 52, 2021-06-01T11:50:52.6230286Z

Fountain, Globe layers, 00:00:26.9353830, 26.1736212523855, 7.88106521471374, 248, 2021-06-01T11:51:24.8112083Z

Park Bench, Globe layers, 00:01:14.9247210, 35.3630635012331, 16.173318728696, 686, 2021-06-01T11:52:45.0723788Z

City Streets, Globe layers, 00:01:00.7292565, 52.9667794150754, 19.9491436296015, 556, 2021-06-01T11:53:50.9410311Z

Hotel Side View, Globe layers, 00:00:46.3354435, 49.7915060474903, 14.9774945382541, 422, 2021-06-01T11:54:42.5611158Z

Tower Top, Globe layers, 00:00:26.5354691, 54.6623844061532, 20.8003929701362, 243, 2021-06-01T11:55:14.2933762Z

Zoom Out From Tower, Globe layers, 00:00:20.4092124, 52.9463457119696, 18.7810597868367, 187, 2021-06-01T11:55:39.7831833Z

Pan Left To Cathedral, Globe layers, 00:00:20.2073422, 52.0174147603845, 14.2306178931309, 184, 2021-06-01T11:56:05.8575009Z

Two Cathedral Tops, Globe layers, 00:00:18.7536073, 51.5641485829455, 16.2826919292295, 172, 2021-06-01T11:56:29.7681601Z

Cathedral Overview, Globe layers, 00:00:38.0621602, 49.6531472808039, 17.9066013911563, 349, 2021-06-01T11:57:13.0413117Z

River View, Globe layers, 00:00:17.5259442, 46.3785886318109, 13.359831850351, 161, 2021-06-01T11:57:35.8499766Z

--------------

DrawTime Sum: 00:05:56.1043702, Count: 11, Average: 00:00:32.3731245

AverageFPS Sum: 148708.51636684, Count: 3249, Average: 45.7705498205109

MinimumFPS Sum: 52956.26892066, Count: 3249, Average: 16.2992517453555

FPSSampleRate = 100 ms

==================

Execution Complete

PerfTools Script Execution Time = 00:06:56.1005055

==================

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

MarcelSt-Germain — Tue, 01 Jun 2021 13:55:44 GMT

Thanks, it's like even with emulation and limited memories, it's very useful. At least very more than my emulation of arc view with my iMac sunflower with virtual pc.

Can't even dream of performance if ESRI can compile ArcGIS Pro for arm and skip the emulation of x86 codes.

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

PeterKnoop — Tue, 01 Jun 2021 15:59:31 GMT

Thanks for sharing your testing results! (I think some of the elapsed times are missing for individual test steps in what you've shared, like the Analysis step?)

GIS can be used in a variety of ways, so it is usually a question of interpreting the results in the context of your own specific workflows. For example, if you have a basic GPU, then it will likely score poorly on the 3D performance tests relative to a powerful GPU. However, if you're not doing the kind of GIS work that needs a powerful GPU, then it can still be a passing score for your use case.

As mentioned in the blog post, the cumulative time it takes to run each test level provides an overall indication of ArcGIS Pro performance on the hardware.

For each test level you run, there should be a summary file (e.g., SUMMARY_Level1.log) which includes a Total Elapsed Time value. That value can be compared to the ranges in the table in the blog post. Or, if you use the run-all test script, then it will produce a CSV file that nicely summarizes each level's elapsed time in one place, which you can then compare to that table.

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

SeanAdlai — Wed, 02 Jun 2021 17:56:41 GMT

Thanks for the guidance Peter.

Results for iMac M1, Parallels, Windows ARM64
- Sharing - 4GB and 4 Cores
(This would be a below spec windows machine)

PAT Test Summary below.
Level 1 Test (In spec, Below avg)
- Expected Range - 2.5-3.3, Avg - 2.8
- Result - 3.164
Level 2 Test (In spec, Below avg)
- Expected Range - 4 - 15, Avg - 8
- Result - 11.122
Level 3 Test (Out of spec)
- Expected Range - 10-39, Avg - 20
- Result - 46.776

Next steps
- Testing a 16GB M1 with 8/12GB VM.

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

fstring — Wed, 02 Jun 2021 19:17:09 GMT

Interesting result on Level 2! My macbook air with similar specs was much slower, but I wondered at the time if that was impacted by passive cooling and thermal throttling. The iMac was faster by 7 minutes!

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

Ratul_Debnath — Mon, 28 Jun 2021 17:43:03 GMT

Could anyone please tell me can I run heavy spatial analysis smoothly on a 13.3-inch MacBook Pro Apple M1 Chip with 8‑Core CPU 8‑Core GPU - Space Gray (16 GB/1 TB) using parallels + Windows Insider preview ARM 64?

I am truly confused and need suggestions. Thanks in advance.

Re: ArcGIS Pro & Desktop on Apple M1

SeanAdlai — Mon, 28 Jun 2021 23:01:04 GMT

Hello Ratul
Great questions.

- The M1for long-term prospects - Right performance but Risky
The 8GB iMac performed within range. 16GB Macbook Pro test had Parallels issue.
Will let you know when I try a 16GB iMac.
BUT - A number of users make the valid point of at least waiting to see Microsoft's commitment ... etc.

- MacBook Pro 32 GB for heavy spatial analysis
I have actually tried with VMWare (Not bootcamp). Fast machine, but bad on GPU intensive tasks.
Last I checked, neither VMWare nor Parallels took full advantage of GPU on Mac running windows.

Your best bet is convincing Apple that ESRI can be a worthy partner to make their maps better :-).

Hope that helps.