idea Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view in ArcGIS Online Ideas

Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

Philip_Ohlinger — Wed, 12 Jul 2023 15:26:48 GMT

Currently, if you have a joined hosted feature layer view setup for a feature layer, you cannot edit the data schema of the layer in ArcGIS Online. This means you cannot add or remove fields, or alter the domains for the features unless you remove the view. This is extremely cumbersome, as we are using the joined hosted feature layer views for many of our features, but also need to periodically make changes to the data schema.

Please allow joined hosted feature layer views to be used while also allowing changes to the data schema of the features. This would save us so much time not having to continually delete and recreate the views.

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

Calvin_Wong — Wed, 16 Aug 2023 19:22:12 GMT

I would also like to see this. It's frustrating having to delete the joined view and re-create it. The view is usually linked to dashboards or Experience Builder and this breaks since the item ID changes after a re-creation.

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

DamienDiVittorio — Wed, 30 Aug 2023 05:04:03 GMT

As a new user on AGOL this issue was extremely frustrating to me! It took me quite a while to figure out why I couldn't edit my hosted feature layers. There has to be a way to lock only the fields used to define the joined view and allow schema and domain changes elsewhere.

At a minimum, their could at least be a pop up to warn users that creating joined hosted feature layer views will not allow schema changes on the parent features/tables. This has been a known issue for years. ☹️

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

Kaz — Tue, 03 Oct 2023 20:48:00 GMT

Agree, this limitation needs to be VERY obvious when you create a join layer, and there needs to be a way to update the source schema afterwards.

Example: A survey is created. The survey feature layer then participates in a live join view. Then you are unable to make changes to the survey. 😞

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

WillyG — Thu, 02 Nov 2023 20:12:45 GMT

We just need a button to disconnect the joined view layer from the source, make schema changes and then reconnect in a seamless manner that would not cause disruption to the end user. Perhaps this could be handled with the update view workflow, not dissimilar form what we have with regular views. How about the ability to swap the source of the hosted join layer to a temporary slave 'Layer'. We can then make changes to the master while we are in this limbo stage and the end user wouldn't notice anything. This seems like it should be reasonably straight forward to implement. Currently we are bending over backwards to provide complex workarounds for this

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

MattyMaps — Mon, 18 Dec 2023 17:58:16 GMT

A pause and refresh view option would solve this

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

DevinCarlson — Thu, 15 Feb 2024 22:32:04 GMT

A solution to this workflow is definitely needed!

Or - a better recommended practice to be able to symbolize features based on the most recent inspection that lives in a related table.

Specific use case: Hydrant Flushing
Hydrant feature is related to Hydrant Maintenance Inspection table.
Currently, we are utilizing the joined view layer to show our field crews and department heads when a recent flushing event occurred - in Field Maps and Experience Builder. When changes to the schema are needed or domains need to be updated/changed - which is inevitable - the join view layer needs to be deleted, changes made, then recreated, resymbolized, and added back into any maps or applications. Very tedious workflow.

We have also tried to use an Arcade Expression in the parent hydrant feature that looks at the related table and populates the parent feature with information from the inspection. This could work, but I am unable to get the parent table to update automatically when the inspection record is submitted. We have to start to edit the parent feature, then the data populates (working in Field Maps).

Regardless, a better workflow to utilize inspection data that lives in a related table is very much needed!

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

jfisher — Sun, 28 Jul 2024 15:00:10 GMT

One possible work around mentioned here is to programmatically find and replace item id's in the definitions of all affected items using the arcgis python api. Using this solution means you need to keep careful track of any item that references your joined-hosted layers.

We have not stared using joined hosted feature layers yet. They are potentially powerful, but this limitation is preventing me from really embracing them.

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

WillyG — Mon, 29 Jul 2024 05:30:29 GMT

I was hoping with the new recycle bin functionality that after we delete the joined view layer it would then unlock the schema, and then we could make our changes to the schema and then restore the joined view layer, but the schema of the master is still locked while in the recycle bin unfortunately. There must be a simple solution to this. We just need a workflow to to swap the joined view layer or disconnect it temporarily so we can unlock schema. We have an update views option in the settings for regular views. Why not joined view layers?

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

JeffShaw — Thu, 08 Aug 2024 03:12:03 GMT

Needing to delete joined views in order modify the joined layers makes them not worth the significant effort and risk to configured apps in almost all cases.

We NEED Esri to get serious about finally providing useful relational data structures in ArcGIS Online after all these years. As a user of Esri products for 37 years I can say that the lack of support for this is baffling and has significantly curtailed the effectiveness and efficiency of our agency in managing natural resources.

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

WillyG — Thu, 08 Aug 2024 03:30:45 GMT

Couldn't agree more @JeffShaw When hosted view layers were re-released in June 2023 it was stated in this blog: that the ability to allow schema changes in source layers is coming Join us in welcoming joined views to the item details page (esri.com)... It has been over a year and there has been complete radio silence. Even giving us functionality to disconnect / reconnect using something like AGOL assistant or view swapping like what is in the regular hosted view workflow is better than nothing.

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

jfisher — Thu, 22 Aug 2024 16:43:11 GMT

EDIT: I have not had time to further test this. I wrote it from memory and it may be mistaken. I'm leaving it for now, in case someone is able to do further testing.

The solution that has been working for me so far is to not delete the joined view, but rather use the REST endpoint: delete from definition. Once the joined view is removed from the service definition, the source layer schema can be edited. You can then use add to definition to re add the joined hosted feature layer(s) back to the service. As long as you add definitions in the appropriate order (so that they have the same service id number they did before removal), apps that consume the joined-hosted-feature-layer-view should continue working: the service itself has not been removed and the id has not changed. The benefit of using the REST endpoints is that you can add many joined hosted feature layers to a single service. This of course should all be done programmatically (I'm using arcgis python api), so that service definitions (joined hosted feature layer view definitions) can be added and removed with the push of a button.

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

WillyG — Thu, 08 Aug 2024 23:40:17 GMT

@jfisher Thank you. So you are effectively disconnecting the joined view from the source and then reconnecting? Can you please share more of your workflow and where to find ':remove from definition' in the REST endpoint

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

AndrewWillingale — Thu, 22 Aug 2024 09:06:26 GMT

I'm unable to make schema edits to a hosted feature layer at the moment. I did have a number of joins and after lots of investigation came across this forum post. I've deleted the join views, which obviously stopped the web map which was accessing these from working, and I still seem to have a schema lock!

If data schemas become locked then we need a clear message to the user telling them why and how.

@LaurenBallantyne I've tagged you in as you wrote the blog linked above. Please can you provide an update about this. Thanks.

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

Philip_Ohlinger — Tue, 07 Jan 2025 15:01:58 GMT

This poses a huge problem for me every day. ESRI, can you please allow changes to the data schema without having to undo all of the joined views I've put into place?

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

WillyG — Tue, 07 Jan 2025 19:50:28 GMT

Can someone from ESRI give an update on this please?

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

AbdiHassan — Sat, 08 Mar 2025 02:18:04 GMT

You can use the update definition on the joined view to allow schema changes to true which should allow you to make schema changes to the source. If you want to add a field and have that field to propagate to the joined view, then you would have to do like @jfisher mentioned, delete the definition of the view and add definition which you need to include the new field.

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

AnneShanahan2 — Wed, 28 May 2025 23:34:02 GMT

Agree with all of the above, this is a real showstopper to our org using live joins. A solution or effective workaround would be hugely appreciated. Then we can retire cumbersome overnight processes.

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

WillyG — Wed, 28 May 2025 23:39:22 GMT

Hi @AbdiHassan That's a good suggestion, I'd like to try that, but would need more guidance on exactly how to do it as I don't have a lot of time to experiment. I still believe that it needs a UI not dissimilar to the update view UI, especially as it was announced in June 2023 that we would be able to update schema. We add fields all the time and don't want to be faffing around with the JSON. Most of our Hosted feature services are sync enabled, so sync errors would also be a concern, You can also see that a lot of people are confused when a joined view layer is in place that they cannot update schema, especially as there is little warning that this is the case. This NEEDS something better than what we have currently. I don't understand why this is not prioritised.

Re: Allow feature services with joined hosted feature layer views to have the data schema updated without removing the view

DavidForbuss1 — Wed, 25 Jun 2025 20:51:31 GMT

I'm running into this problem now as well. Luckily, we're in the testing phase of using a spatial layer joined to a table that was imported from MSAccess. It's still very cumbersome to have to delete the view, then recreate it, and trying to remember all of the symbology/labels/pop-ups. It should be as simple as updating a domain on the joined table, then clicking 'Update View'.