topic Re: Is it's possible to connect ArcGIS Server for WorkGroup to full MSSQL? in ArcGIS Enterprise Questions

Is it's possible to connect ArcGIS Server for WorkGroup to full MSSQL?

DmitryBubnenkov — Thu, 03 Apr 2014 17:58:51 GMT

I know that ArcGIS for Server for workgroup can work only with MSSQL Express. But is it's possible co connect with full version of MSSQL? I need to test how it would work with big DB.

Re: Is it's possible to connect ArcGIS Server for WorkGroup to full MSSQL?

WilliamCraft — Thu, 03 Apr 2014 23:58:26 GMT

I know that ArcGIS for Server for workgroup can work only with MSSQL Express. But is it's possible co connect with full version of MSSQL? I need to test how it would work with big DB.

I am not sure that I really understand the question. Are you asking if ArcGIS for Server Workgroup will work with SQL Server Standard or SQL Server Enterprise as an alternative to the Express version of the database? If that is the case, I am not sure... you can certainly try it but I am not sure why you would want to do that. The Workgroup level of ArcGIS for Server is limited to 10 concurrent geodatabase connections, 4 licensable cores, and single-machine deployments. If the Standard or Enterprise versions of the database do work with Workgroup, then at least you'll avoid the 10 GB limit of storage imposed by the Workgroup level of the software I suppose.

Below are the differences between Workgroup and Enterprise levels of ArcGIS for Server:
http://www.esri.com/software/arcgis/arcgisserver/features/enterprise-workgroup

Re: Is it's possible to connect ArcGIS Server for WorkGroup to full MSSQL?

DmitryBubnenkov — Fri, 04 Apr 2014 04:11:01 GMT

Yes. We have ArcGIS For Server for workgroup, but we need to create raster mosaic with thousand of rasters. The limitation of SQLExpress is 10GB. End I have got next questions:
1. Do license allow us to unde SQL Standard instead of SQLExpress? There is no problem with limits of connection and available cores. We just need bigger DB
2. If license do not allow to use it, is there any restriction, that would lock ability to connect with SQL Standard? We want to test it at first, and only then think about can we buy it or no.

Re: Is it's possible to connect ArcGIS Server for WorkGroup to full MSSQL?

WilliamCraft — Fri, 04 Apr 2014 12:20:19 GMT

Yes. We have ArcGIS For Server for workgroup, but we need to create raster mosaic with thousand of rasters. The limitation of SQLExpress is 10GB. End I have got next questions:
1. Do license allow us to unde SQL Standard instead of SQLExpress? There is no problem with limits of connection and available cores. We just need bigger DB
2. If license do not allow to use it, is there any restriction, that would lock ability to connect with SQL Standard? We want to test it at first, and only then think about can we buy it or no.

I believe the size limit is controlled by Microsoft (hence the difference between Express and Standard), whereas the other two limitations (i.e., number of cores to utilize and number of concurrent geodatabase connections) is controlled by the Esri ECP authorization number. In applying this logic, I would suspect that you could authorize a SQL Server Standard database with a Workgroup ECP in order to accommodate your DB size requirement. If you are making a purchase/no-purchase decision based on this information, I would suggest you verify this with Esri just to be safe.

Re: Is it's possible to connect ArcGIS Server for WorkGroup to full MSSQL?

DmitryBubnenkov — Sat, 05 Apr 2014 09:17:24 GMT

Could I use MSSQL 2012/2014 with ArcGIS Server 10.2 with SDE to storage rasters? The docs says only about Win 2008 R2 Server?

> If you are making a purchase/no-purchase decision based on this information, I would suggest you verify this with Esri just to be safe.
How can verify it?

Re: Is it's possible to connect ArcGIS Server for WorkGroup to full MSSQL?

WilliamCraft — Sat, 05 Apr 2014 12:29:04 GMT

Microsoft Windows Server 2012 R2 support begins at ArcGIS 10.2.1, not 10.2 so you would need to upgrade to the 10.2.1 release to use that version of SQL Server. Remember that, for SQL Server 2012, it must be the 64-bit version (R2) and not the 32-bit version. SQL Server 2014 is not supported with any release of Esri's software.

Source: http://resources.arcgis.com/en/help/system-requirements/10.2/index.html#/Microsoft_SQL_Server_Database_Requirements/015100000070000000/

To verify that SQL Server 2008 (likely R2) Standard will work with an Workgroup ECP, you should call Esri Tech Support and open a ticket to ask this question.

I hope the information that I've given you has been helpful. It would be great if you could vote up helpful responses using the green check and arrow tools to the right. Thanks!

Re: Is it's possible to connect ArcGIS Server for WorkGroup to full MSSQL?

MarcoBoeringa — Sat, 05 Apr 2014 12:50:28 GMT

Yes. We have ArcGIS For Server for workgroup, but we need to create raster mosaic with thousand of rasters. The limitation of SQLExpress is 10GB.

As to the bold remarks, you probably want to read Vince's (ESRI) remarks in the thread post linked below (e.g. "Raster support in databases is very nearly only for backward compatibility at this point.").

Directly storing huge amounts of raster data in an enterprise database / RDBMS, instead of using Mosaic Datasets referencing the original raster data files on a file system, is not a recommended practice anymore (if it ever really were). ESRI's strategy for the future is raster datasets outside the enterprise database, but referenced through a Mosaic Dataset, allowing flexible management of the rasters, while not burdening the enterprise database / RDBMS with the task of storing the actual data.

http://forums.arcgis.com/threads/102936-Postgress-PostGIS-Rasters-in-ArcGIS-not-working?p=371748&viewfull=1#post371748

This is also similar to other trends in the database world, with file storage for huge amounts of unstructured data outside the RDBMS, but "managed" and referenced inside the RDBMS / data warehouse.

Re: Is it's possible to connect ArcGIS Server for WorkGroup to full MSSQL?

DmitryBubnenkov — Sat, 05 Apr 2014 14:49:17 GMT

We would use ArcGis for Server for creating Web Portal. On the portal user should be able to query satellite images. And every image should display on map.

As I understood we do not need to store rasters in SQL DB and should use filebase system. But would we have any troubles with multiple access from web if for example 10 or 20 people would request same image mosaic? I have heard about some file system locks or something like it.

Also how to manage in filebase db attributes? Can I do select and insert operation from script/ written from scratch app without running ArcGIS. The problem that I can't image how to work with filebase system.

Re: Is it's possible to connect ArcGIS Server for WorkGroup to full MSSQL?

WilliamCraft — Sat, 05 Apr 2014 14:58:51 GMT

Rasters can be stored on the file system, inside (managed) or outside (unmanaged) a raster catalog or as part of a mosaic dataset (if you have Image Server extension, you can publish mosaic datasets to image or map services). You can also add all of your raster images to a map document as separate tiles and publish it, but if you have a lot of images then that can be overwhelming in terms of layer count, layer grouping, etc. Another option would be to generate a single raster image by mosaicing all of your imagery together into one raster, stored either on the file system as a TIF, JPG, SID, etc. or in a file geodatabase. Often times your performance will be better to keep rasters out of an RDBMS unless you're an expert on tuning your database for storing such content. Your solution will depend on things like the type and amount of imagery that you have and want to publish, as well as whether or not you have Image Server... not to mention the RDBMS (SQL Server Express vs. Standard). Personally, I've had good luck and performance with unmanaged raster catalogs stored in a file geodatabase where the individual raster tiles were stored on the same local array as the raster catalog. It doesn't require an RDBMS nor does it require Image Server licensing. Multi-access from a large number of users shouldn't be a problem... these are simply read-only connections.

Re: Is it's possible to connect ArcGIS Server for WorkGroup to full MSSQL?

MarcoBoeringa — Sat, 05 Apr 2014 19:57:10 GMT

As I understood we do not need to store rasters in SQL DB and should use filebase system. But would we have any troubles with multiple access from web if for example 10 or 20 people would request same image mosaic? I have heard about some file system locks or something like it.

You are not going to access the file system directly from the outside world, ArcGIS for Server and the webservices you define for it, will be handling all this. This shouldn't be an issue, this is what ArcGIS for Server is all designed for, taking care of such multiple access against webservices.

Also how to manage in filebase db attributes? Can I do select and insert operation from script/ written from scratch app without running ArcGIS. The problem that I can't image how to work with filebase system.

I really think you should start delving into the vast ArcGIS Help system concerning raster management options. A good starting point could be the following pages:

Raster data organization

What is a mosaic dataset?

Especially start reading about the ArcGIS Mosaic Dataset datatype. Realize first that Mosaic Datasets are a kind of "wrapper" around huge collections of raster datasets stored on a file system. They allow you to properly manage such collections, and do all kinds of fancy things like color balancing between images, and run dozens of other functions as well. The nicest thing about this all, is that these functions operate "on-the-fly", so they don't affect or touch the original data, but the functions (for example the color balancing), is done "on-the-fly" during display.

Re: Is it's possible to connect ArcGIS Server for WorkGroup to full MSSQL?

DmitryBubnenkov — Sun, 06 Apr 2014 11:14:57 GMT

Thanks! I will reread docs. But if I will storage rasters in raster mosaic in FS should I use SQL for storage metadate? I understand that I can put some meta-date in raster mosaic, but in our case we will have next meta date:
-date
-time
-satellite type
-status (already loaded/processed)

This meta-date I will take from another DB and some of them from text files. By this meta-date we will plan to do query from web-portal. For my regret I have not enough experience to create good architecture. Could you explain me best way to do it's in my situation.

Every images would be 100-150 MB size in JPG\JP2 format. Every day we will plan to load in 10-20 images.

Also could you explain what data usually storage in SQL if biggest part (raster data) are usually storage in FS.